Piers Morgan — a well-known and sometimes controversial British journalist — hosted neurosurgeon Michael Egnor and prominent science author Michael Shermer on his YouTube channel, Piers Morgan Uncensored, to discuss hot topics from The Immortal Mind (Worthy, June 3, 2025):
No Simple Way of Explaining Away Near-Death Experiences
Not surprisingly, near-death experiences (NDEs) headlined the discussion. But Dr. Egnor’s comments make clear that The Immortal Mind deals with them in the context of much other evidence for the immateriality of the human mind.
The opening summary gives a good sense of where we are with NDEs:
Morgan: [0:00] All near-death experiences where you encounter people on the other side are people who are dead even if you didn’t know they were dead. People who near or have near-death experiences have something called terminal lucidity, often summoning their loved ones to say goodbye. Is it mere noise from a dying brain? Or is it a signal intimating what lies beyond? What is the soul that’s supposedly floating out there?
Shermer: There is no scientific theory explains everything. This is true with UFOs and psychics and whatnot. And it’s just okay to say, you know what, we can’t explain everything and there’s still a lot unknown. Let’s keep an open mind.
Egnor: How, Michael, do you explain the hundreds of accurate perceptions by people who are having near-death experiences of the goings-on in the room?
Morgan: It’s the fact that we can’t explain these things which makes me believe claims like Dr. Egnor is making must have validity. Human beings have always been obsessed with the question of whether there’s life after death. Religion teaches that there is something more than mere mortality. Mainstream science, however, is decidedly unconvinced.
Some Surprising Elements of the Discussion
Shermer is famous as the editor-in-chief of Skeptic Magazine but about NDEs he is, shall we say, cautiously skeptical.
Morgan was, overall, sympathetic. True, he is a Catholic. But he is no stranger to getting fired for calling out nonsense when he thinks he sees it. He wants hard evidence and he seems to understand that the evidence for the immateriality and immortality of the human mind is actually quite good, though somewhat embarrassing to determined materialists.
Morgan and Shermer veered off from neuroscience and the soul a few times into theorizing about the Big Bang, Ouija boards, etc., along with transhumanism and sentient AI.
But it remained great TV and Egnor was able to get across two key points: Neuroscience provides much evidence for the immateriality of some aspects of the human mind. And neuroscientists who have made significant contributions — Charles Sherrington (1857–1952), Wilder Penfield (1891–1976), John Eccles (1903–1997), Benjamin Libet (1916–2007) — have recognized that.
At time of writing, there were 1,726 comments and one thing that stood out was the commenters’ appreciation of a cordial discussion of often-controversial topics. At the top:
- “What a relief. Two guests who aren’t shouting at each other, presenting their opinions with respect. Like it!”
- “What made this so so much better is there was no interrupting by all 3 of them.
- “Please do more episodes like this. this was such a fresh thing to have a real discussion about.”
These top three comments may have been chosen by staff but their sentiment was frequently echoed below.
Image source: Discovery Institute.More for Your Viewing Pleasure…
You can catch Michael Egnor talking about these and other topics from The Immortal Mind on the following podcasts as well:
Sean McDowell: With a couple of revealing excerpts from the transcript. The soul can seem a bit of a mystery because the popular idea of the soul, as a sort of “ghost,” is not the traditional philosophical (or Christian) one.
Lee Warren: Two neurosurgeons on life, death, eternity and what truly matters. Lee Warren interviews Michael Egnor on The Immortal Mind. The two doctors turned out to share a bond of personal pain as well as immortal hope.
Michael Shermer: Neurosurgeon Michael Egnor vs. neuroscientist Christof Koch. The debate, hosted by Shermer, was cordial, and quite relatable. At one point, the discussion turned on the case of a girl who had her sense of guilt removed surgically. What does that prove about the mind and the brain?
Catholic Bookworm: Catholic Bookworm features Dr. Egnor who stresses the importance of communicating reflections on the findings of neuroscience in relation to the immortality of the soul in a way that is accessible to the public. A radio version of the program is also available for download at iHeart.
Cross-posted at Mind Matters News.